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Atom-Syntax Sin Tax
by Don Park at 2003/12/02 20:53:04

Based on ongoing discussion in the atom-syntax mailing list over my Making Atom Happen proposal, most of them are not even taking the proposal seriously.  One even called it trolling.  Hogwash.  If you are doing something that affects my life, I have the right to do something about it.

So it looks like all of us are going to pay for their pride and esthetic obsession: a sin tax over the syntax fetish.  If you want to do something about it, go to the JustSayNoToAtomFeed page at Atom Wiki and add your voice of support.  If we are going to be ignored anyway, lets get ignored blatantly.  It doesn't matter if you are a developer or a user, you'll be taxed so you have a say.

Comments
pb   at 2003/12/03 07:55:46 AM
The whole point Atom is to develop something that is not RSS. So, yes, your proposal is trolling.

jt   at 2003/12/03 10:18:09 AM
I notice, from studying all of Blogaria not just Atom, that there are an awful lotta idiots that can type some very intelligent-sounding memes.


Don Park   at 2003/12/03 10:52:44 AM
Ahem. I AM an engineer, so I do believe the Atom process can be *debugged* although the stain of emotions will be difficult to remove. Meanwhile, I do find their creative explanations rather enjoyable because they reminds me of Mount Nevermind from Dragonlance.

Zoe   at 2003/12/03 11:55:38 AM
Anything but Dave Winer


jt   at 2003/12/03 12:01:25 PM
Well then, Don, as a software engineer mebbe you can hep me out... I'm tired of entering comments and getting an error! ;-D


jt   at 2003/12/03 12:32:47 PM
I tried to post below to wiki twice but messed up and mebbe was "refactoring" the dadburn thing (but at least saved it the second time):


pb   at 2003/12/03 02:07:30 PM
Nice try, jt, but I'm not trolling. A key reason for Atom's birth is that it was decided that something that was not RSS was needed. So to go to them and suggest basing it on RSS is, indeed, trolling.

jt   at 2003/12/03 03:04:30 PM
It really doesn't matter what you call it, pb.


d.w. (Dave Walker)   at 2003/12/03 03:52:31 PM

Earlier in this thread, JT made a comment that the statement that "The fact is that Dave Winer has asked us not to create a new version of RSS, and we plan to respect his wishes." is a lie. The relevant support for this statement is here: http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss#roadmap


Dave Winer   at 2003/12/03 04:19:17 PM
DW, it was a lie.


Don Park   at 2003/12/03 04:23:51 PM
I think it depends on how the sentences are read. But then there are more recent statements from Dave [Winer] that clarifies his position.


d.w. (Dave Walker)   at 2003/12/03 05:16:38 PM
Dave: I always read that statement as "do whatever you feel you need to, just don't call it RSS." Did I (and apparently many others) read too much into it? And I still think "lie" is awfully loaded language.

jt   at 2003/12/03 05:57:18 PM
Dave Walker,


jt   at 2003/12/03 06:17:35 PM
Btw, Dave Walker,


pb   at 2003/12/03 06:52:16 PM
Get a grip, jt. Read and understand my post before commenting. That way you won't look like an idiot.


d.w. (Dave Walker)   at 2003/12/04 01:47:59 AM
If you were actually following the technical end of this (rather than the spectacular but ultimately rather empty "but think of the CHILDREN" political end), which you apparently aren't, you'd see that a new draft of the Atom API was submitted for comment less than 2 days ago ( http://bitworking.org/projects/atom/ ). If the people working on Atom are guilty of anything, it's of focusing on technical minutae and not paying enough attention to the psycho-historical marketing end of things, which is the only environment in which the wild leaps of imagination recorded in your 6:57 and 7:17 comments can thrive.

Randy Charles Morin   at 2003/12/04 09:22:06 AM
I've talked w/ few Atoms :) and they wont hear of RSS 2.0 or no REST. The solution. Do RSS 2.0 namespace w/ SOAP protocol.


Don Park   at 2003/12/04 10:15:56 AM
Thanks for trying Randy. Unfortunately, it is not the technology that is at the heart of the problem, but the people. Even if 'Atoms' achieve what they want to do or alternative solutions like the one you suggest are realized, everybody loses in the end. Maybe that is the natural path...

Randy Charles Morin   at 2003/12/04 02:07:09 PM
I dont like to lose :)

Michael Bernstein   at 2003/12/05 12:56:58 PM
Look, I've posted a lot on this topic, but I'll try one last time:


Randy Charles Morin   at 2003/12/08 10:31:20 AM
Here's the beginning of merging RSS and Atom.

Bill Kearney   at 2003/12/12 10:36:04 AM
Atom's greatest utility lies in it's ability to provide a uniform interface and interop format for the handling of weblog content. THAT some folks would like to deflect it into other arguments about syndication doesn't change the value of it's initial mission. This is what google, mt, lj and others sought and this is what they're getting. Frankly Winer's dangled the idea of it being a replacement of RSS and you fools have bought it hook, lie and sinker.

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